Staring @ trichomes with High Times' Ellen Holland

The Oakland author-editor on bringing growers' dreams to life, plus Europe's cannabis revolution

I’m going to assume you won’t read my conversation with High Times magazine editor Ellen Holland to its conclusion, because… when’s the last time ya did that?

The assumption is that you won’t finish my work here 😌 so let me give you the last line, as it slays me.

“So, what’s on the April cover?” I ask.

“The April cover? Some weed,” Ellen answered.

And we laughed, just like Beavis and Butthead. High Times is famously married to a cover model named Bud.

We first met during the pandemic at the California State Fair’s first cannabis exhibition, hanging out—masked up—and signing books for the wowed civilians of Sacramento and points adjacent. Despite not seeing half of other’s faces, we got on swell. Meanwhile, fair goers kept coming for Holland’s Weed: A Connoisseur’s Guide to Cannabis. It would go on to do such big numbers—21,000 copies—that the literary product has been reworked and repackaged by The Quattro Group as Weed: Smoke It, Eat It, Grow It.

Consumers of the Sojourn video podcasts know that our conversation begins with Holland’s vivid reporting on Spannabis, a singular weed celebration in Barcelona. She had just returned. (Holland’s High Times article on La Crème Gràcia, dropped on Monday.

Her magazine is celebrating its 50th anniversary. I got bounced from middle school band, in part for having an open High Times on my music stand, where my sheet music should have been. I get the international reverence for the brand.

And I treasure this talk. Before we get into our bag of Beavis and Butthead, Holland and I wax nostalgic about her origins as a small-town editor in San Luis Obispo County and take our shots at the California State Fair’s cannabis competition grounds.

Our words have been lightly edited, for clarity.

Donnell Alexander: We have someone today who can say, “I just flew in from Spain and boy are my arms tired.” But they aren’t, because of a little side trip that hopefully we’ll talk about a little bit. We’ve got the editor of High Times magazine: Author Ellen Holland, welcome to The Sojourn.

You just got back from Spannabis. You can tell me: Is that the best way to spend a spring on this planet?

Ellen Holland: I think so. Yeah. It was incredible. The show itself is the biggest weed show in the world, and its all based on seeds, which is really cool: To see the global community uniting around what’s new in genetics, what’s the hot things we’re going to grow next. Just very international.

The event itself is really busy, very crazy. There’s all kinds of side parties and things like that. It’s really nice to have all of your friends in the weed world descending upon Barcelona, partying at all the clubs, and doing that stuff.

DA: How long have you been going?

EH: I just went last year, then this year I went again. Once you’ve gone, I feel like you’ve got to go again.

DA: Well that’s a recommendation and a half. What’s the difference between last year and this year?

EH: Um…

DA: Aside from not being a newbie.

EH: Last year I spent a lot of time with my friends from The Humboldt Seed Company. I did different things with them. I went to the Marijuana and Hemp Museum and there was the debut of their new strain collaboration that they were doing with Sensi Seeds. I was hanging out with a different crew, it was real fun.

I think a lot of people go to Spannabis and bunk up with people, so it’s kind of like The Real World: The Weed World [laughter] So The Humboldt Seed Company were my roommates for seven days. And Ed Rosenthal and his wife Jane. This year was different in the sense that I went with my husband, and we got a hotel and I wasn’t constantly in the weed zone.

Ellen Holland

DA: So, in 2024, why does a conference that focuses on seeds matter so much?

EH: I think cannabis is getting so much more global, and these are the opportunities for us to unite around the global scene—especially to see what genetics people are interested in. Here in California we’re always developing new genetics and new types of weed, but seeing those old-school strains was really exciting for me. The companies out of Amsterdam being able to like, “Oh yeah, I want a Super Silver Haze!” I’m sort of a sativa-leaning person, so I was smoking a lot of Amnesia Haze, which is sort of like the Budweiser of weed clubs in Spain. [Laughs] It was great to return to the classics, and also see the influence of California genetics—which ones made it over there. which ones were really trending.

With so many companies turning over while we were there—you know Germany’s coming to their form of legalization—it was cool to see the global community’s way more excited about legalization. Here in California, we’ve gone through legalization process and we’ve kind of seen the elimination of our old homies and friends’ businesses that didn’t survive. It’s really hard and we’re kind of jaded about it, but there it’s just the old-school excitement. It’s “Yeah! Weed rules!” [Laughs] The kind of joy that we still have every once in a while, but we… don’t always have.”

DA: Yeah, I feel like the weed joy right now is for people who are participants on the other side of the counter, you know?

EH: Right?

DA: They’re 90 percent oblivious to what’s going on here, so they’re having a revolution. Unfortunately, the people who paved the way are paying the price.

Legalization is sweeping Europe. Are you offering cautionary tales? How are you talking to them about America and their future?

EH: For me, it changed from “legalization” to “what type of legalization?” The devil’s in the details of what the plan is. As different countries adopt different rules, hopefully someone’s going to get it right eventually. But it seems like every time that it happens there’s a little bit off. There’s something going wrong.

DA: That’s one way to describe it: a politely irregular industry. Fitting in some ways, but not quite right. I didn’t mean to cut you off. Is that the type of conversation you have with the international crowd?

EH: With the international crowd I’m not really telling them what to do or anything. I’m just celebrating with them and smoking with them. Checkin’ out their weed.

DA: I read that Spannabis boosts the Barcelona economy fairly significantly. I’m not really clear on how. Is this just from you buying up hotels? Are there other activities?

EH: Everyone’s showing up there in Barcelona to spend their money at all of the restaurants and hotels. That’s a huge thing. I saw a lot of stores—as in a lot of places—that are pretending to be the social clubs—you know the ones that are like Weed Week candies, that kind of crap. So there are those kinds of stores in The Gothic Quarter that were like, “Welcome Spannabis: We swear this is not just CBD!” Stuff like that.

You could tell that the city itself knew we were in town, and it was definitely interesting in that the authorities said they were cracking down this year. They said they didn’t want so many people coming in for Spannabis. They did end up raiding a lot of the clubs in the weeks prior to the show and, I think, during the show. So, there was a little bit of a climate of, “Don’t go to that place. It’s hot.” It’s weird to be in that situation when you’re from California and we’re smokin’ where we want to, doin’ what we want to do.

In that situation you can’t really smoke on the streets, you have to be really discreet. I went to a certain club. They signed me up, and right in the sign-in area they said, “Well, if they police show up, you’re going to want to put the weed in your underwear, because that’s the only place that they’re not going to check. You’re going to put the weed in your underwear, and then we’re going to lead you out the back door. That was at the sign-up, and so I was like [tiny voice] “o-kay!”

But then I also went to a really nice club, La Crème Gràcia, in the Gràcia neighborhood, and it was very homey. Like, there was a little cute dog that had its nose under the door when you went inside. I didn’t get the spiel about putting the weed in your underwear or that kind of stuff. So, there are different places where you can go, but it’s not a fully legal situation.

DA: Before we got started, I asked you about the quality of weed there and you kind of answered a little bit when you talked about the genetics that are being engaged back there, but I thought about this is because one of the first conversations I had on this Substack was with Ngaio Bealum and he talked a lot of smack about weed in Europe. You’re not so critical.

EH: No, I thought it was pretty good! The flower was pretty good. If anything, it just had a lower THC profile, which is fine. You don’t want to get blitzed out all of the time. And the hash culture’s really big in Spain. A lot of the Spanish hash makers took awards at some of the events. It seems really good. I smoked some of it, and I feel like the hash is the end goal in Spain, instead of the flour. But I found it to be delightful.

DA: I think those are lofty aims; I love a good hashish.

I had some weed about 10 days ago. It got me really, really high. And umm… it was High Times weed! And I’d not quite forgotten that High Times had gotten into the business of it—but I was surprised it was really good. No knock on High Times—

EH: Hey! [Laughs]

DA: For people who don’t follow the industry that closely, when did this happen?

EH: I’ve been with the company for two years, so maybe a year before that. High Times obtained a lot of different dispensaries, got a cultivation license and partnered also with a hash-making company. So now we’re putting out cannabis under our own brand.

DA: The business has changed in ways that we cannot even begin to quantify. Is it interesting to work for a place that’s not just reporting on cannabis, but manufacturing it?

EH: I always say that journalism is not the most lucrative field. And you know that it’s not the most lucrative field. So, I would say, Let’s sell the weed, that’s what people want. I actually think selling the weed to sustain the journalism is a smart move. People want the weed, you know?

[Laughter]

DA: What’s it like working for a print magazine in 2024?

EH: It’s fun. I feel really blessed to have the opportunity to do it. It’s where my skill sets lie. The staff is really pared down, so I’m actually choosing the covers, the images on the cover, choosing the art on the back, arranging all of the covers on the inside. And then assigning them, getting all of the writers together and putting the budgets together. It’s just a really fun thing to make something every month that’s an art project. The end result is just a beautiful thing.

As the person choosing the images on the cover, too, it’s really fun. It’s like, “It’s not crystal-y enough.” “I wouldn’t smoke this in a million years.” And making people’s dreams with that stuff. People still really respect High Times magazine from the past, its legacy and it’s a lot of people’s dream to be in High Times magazine.

DA: We talked about this in Sacramento, at the State Fair. And you talked about it depth. Making people’s dreams come true. I think people might have an idea about that, but… tell me what you mean.

EH: People just say, Oh, I wish I was in High Times. I wish it was the centerfold in, the cover of High Times. A lot of people, they think it’s real cool. They always saw it as the preeminent cannabis publication, and now they’re in it. Being in California, there are so many stories here that never got told in High Times magazine. It was always a New York publication. Now it’s just really easy to tell the stories that we have here in the state.

DA: I’m fascinated with the medium itself. Do you know who your readers are? I still see magazines—some brilliantly made magazines—but I don’t usually see people reading magazines. I imagine it’s a lot more private than it used to be, but do you think the readership has changed? Is it demonstrably different from the one that’s reading online?

EH: No, I don’t think so. I think they’re the same.

DA: You don’t think they’re in it for the art more with the print publication? Just the experience of it?

EH: Maybe there are some older people who’ve been subscribing for a long time who are looking for that, but I always think the audience is me. That’s how I do it. [laughs] Does this appeal to me? Great.

DA: For a lot of people, you’re living the dream.

EH: Yeah. Being a journalist full time I’m living the dream—that’s what it is. And to be a journalist in a field like this, where you get to smoke weed and go to parties and write about it. Anyone I want to call that is a grower and I say, “I want to come out to your farm,” they say, Of course. Come on out. It’s a cool way to get access to places that have been hidden in the past.

DA: I’m assuming that you were talking news in Europe. What were the big issues that people were talking about?

EH: It was Germany. Everyone was excited about Germany, because it was about to change and turn over. And the Spanish scene, the crackdowns and the raids. People were talking a lot about that. “Be careful!” “Put it in your shoe!” Stuff like that.

DA: What do you think is the state of weed journalism?

EH: I feel sorry for people who have to put out story after story after story. You know, have to work from press releases, not really get to the heart of things. I feel very lucky that I can spend time on things that I want to spend time on. I can write about what I want to write about. I can take the time to write a really beautiful piece. I can go to the farm. I can smoke the weed, I can meet the people.

It’s very rare to be able to have a platform where I can essentially do the reporting that I want to do, and not have to do sponsored content and not have to do all of those other things that come with cannabis journalism.

Some reporters have to produce five stories a day. The quality starts to drop. That’s not the situation that I’m in now, so I feel really happy about that.

DA: Let’s talk about that origin of yours, because you’re from straight journalism, right? You’ve worked at small-town papers. Can you give us your resume?

EH: I went to UC Santa Cruz—a Banana slug—and then I started working at a newspaper in Atascadero, California. And I worked my way up to be the editor of that paper, which was crazy: I was in my twenties and had my own little office. I would call the police chief and stuff. Charles Lynch, that case that just got settled—

DA: Really, I did not know that!

EH: From not so long ago, yes! I’m going to tell it wrong, but the LA Times asked more questions, and [the prosecution] ended up saying, Forget it. We’re dropping it.

DA: I’m sorry I missed that. For people who don’t know, it’s a key story in the history of weed in California, also in that Central Coast area—a fascinating weed scenario.

EH: He opened his first shop in Atascadero when I was there. And I was a little newspaper reporter. Of course I was on the scene to cover that. They ended up chasing him out of town. He went to Morrow Bay, where he got a ribbon cutting. Everyone was very excited to see him, and then things started going the wrong way for him. That was my first reporting, back in the day.

DA: And from Atascadero you went where?

EH: After that I just floated around, just trying to be a journalist, doing other things. And then ended up back here in The Bay. I worked at a magazine called Cannabis Now magazine for a lot of years. Started as the publisher’s assistant, just like, scheduling calls and making flight arrangements. I told em, “You know I can write, right?” I’m just trying to get way in there, and they said, Sure. Go ahead and start writing.

I worked my way up to the content role and then started being a lower-level editor. I never wanted to be at the top, because I’d always feel it was with the basketball coach and I was going to get flipped if I got too hot too fast. So, I worked with a number of editors at Cannabis Now and eventually became the senior editor there.

Then the pandemic happened and everything went pffftt. I stopped working for them and I got an opportunity to write a book. It’s called Weed: A Connoisseur’s Guide to Cannabis. I wrote that during the dark days of pandemic times, kinda worked with my sources that I’d worked with over the years at Cannabis Now. It was a great success and I flipped that into the job at High Times.

The pandemic was such a disruption. But it ended up being a good disruption, because I’m the kind of person that’s very loyal and would have just stuck with the pack.

DA: But you did another book, didn’t you?

EH: The first book sold so well that they did a revision of it. They kind of flipped it made it different—with illustrations—but it’s the same.

DA: Would you do another book?

EH: I would, actually. But it was torture, man. You know. [Laughs]

DA: What’s the point of it? Why did you say yes to that, something that you admit is torture?

EH: I had to. What else was I going to do? I had this opportunity to write this book. There wasn’t anything else that was there for me. It was, ‘I better do this. This is the next thing.’ Especially during the pandemic. Gosh. It was such dark days and on one of the days the fires were happening here and the sun didn’t even shine. And I thought, “Do I have to keep writing this book?”

I didn’t have my old office, I had to do it from home. It was 30,000 words in three months that I had to produce. It’s very nerve-wracking to write a book… but when you’re done with it the glory you have. Everyone in your life comes out and says, we’re so proud of you. More so than my graduation, more than my wedding.

People are just like, “We’re so proud of you. You did it.” Especially during the pandemic, everyone said, I’m going to do this. I’m going to do that. I have so much time. [Laughs] I actually did something—It’s a book! [Laughs]

DA: That’s something. You definitely get to brag about that. I find that it’s very rewarding to write a book, but it’s super hard. Anyone who goes for it, there’s something… I was going to say there’s something wrong with you. But there’s something special about you. [Laughter] Pandemic or not, because a lot of people approach me saying they’re going to write a book and they never do.

EH: So hard.

DA: But you did it. What do you have going next?

EH: With the revision of the book I feel like I have a second opportunity to get out and promote it in person. It was the dark days of the pandemic. We went to the state fair and that was awesome.

DA: It was a showcase of cannabis at the state fair, which was kind of groundbreaking, you know?

EH: It was.

DA: It was a very big space—very well done—with the history of cannabis—what am I forgetting. I just remember a lot of beautiful stuff being shown to the mainstream. I just remember that at the opening, people were taking pictures.in front of the gate—

EH: Yes!

DA: Just because their thing had gone so mainstream. Did you enjoy it?

EH: Yeah, I thought it was real cool in the sense that they had plants there to show people. I remember the last time I saw a weed plant; some people only see the end product, right? The flowers or things like that. I thought it was real cool that they had the plants. I thought it was really interesting that people wanted the CBD slushies or whatever that they were willing to pay $10 for.

I think their competition is interesting. It’s cool that they’re doing a cannabis competition, but they’re doing it by the numbers only. They’re just getting the lab results. No one’s smoking the weed. No one’s smelling the weed, no one’s touching the weed. That would be ridiculous if that’s how they did the wine competition. Or the beer competition. That needs to change. People need to actually try it.

DA: Back in 2013 I tried to do a cannabis cookbook. I don’t think we ever talked about it, but I went to [literary] agencies and I found an agent who got onboard eventually. But it was so hard to find an agent, in part because one of the big chains down South—Books-a-Million—didn’t do cannabis anything at that point and it was like six percent of the market or something like that. No [one’s] going to write that off.

I’ve always thought there these underlying prohibition-mind things that keep cannabis out of the mainstream. I thought a little bit about the [fair’s] not having tastings there, but you break it down and, yeah, it’s ridiculous.

EH: Yeah, it’s ridiculous. But it’s cool that the winners that would be the winners are still the winners, just from the test results? You know? I feel like the results are valid, but also… c’mon. You’ve gotta smoke the weed. You gotta smell it. You’ve got to look at it. They wouldn’t do that with the wine competition, just get the results of the alcohol content in the grapes. [Laughs]

DA: I think it speaks to their understanding of what they think people come to weed for. What’s on the cover in April?

EH: The April cover? Some weed.